GoodScienceForYou Neutral Evolution Forum - There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.

MajorAtheist

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #30 - Jan 29^th, 2010 at 1:10pm

GoodScienceForYou wrote on Jan 28^th, 2010 at 7:44pm:

I find it funnier than hell that you atheists are superstitious and believe in luck and other irrational crap, and for some reason you think that evoldelusion validates your hate of god and your emotional needs to justify your weakness caused by your human compulsions and desires?

WHAHA! A lack of belief is not hate.

Here let me prove it! LMAO!

I believe in Santa, but I bet you don't. I believe that Santa is the TRUTH. This truth is the best, most powerful, all knowing THING that we have. Whatever this TRUTH says we must obey, for this TRUTH knows more than we do.

Now, since this TRUTH is right, we must make laws to reflect this TRUTH.

The moment you don't like the laws that are made, and the moment you speak up about making laws based on SANTA..............is the moment we call you a hater!!!

Why are you hating SANTA! What did he ever do to you besides bring you presents if you were good?

SEE brother, you are just a HATER of Santa! You are just filled with HATE! Or wait, is it just a lack of belief?

So, brother, you can continue to LIE all you want, its really up to you and how honest you can be!

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MajorAtheist

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #31 - Jan 29^th, 2010 at 1:12pm

GoodScienceForYou wrote on Jan 28^th, 2010 at 7:52pm:

Only a ignorant fool, who is incapable of reasoning would believe in random.

Only an ignorant fool will not predict the outcome of a flipped coin, since you are either penniless or incapable of performing tasks that will prove you wrong.

SEE brother, two can play that game and if you want to continue playing that game, it will only make it easy on me.

I really don't want to put forth the effort to prove you wrong, I would only rather just SAY you are wrong just like you do. This style of debate is so much easier and lacks substance.

But it is you that has reduced to playing dirty!

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MajorAtheist

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #32 - Jan 29^th, 2010 at 1:14pm

GoodScienceForYou wrote on Jan 28^th, 2010 at 7:52pm:

Only a ignorant fool, who is incapable of reasoning would believe in random.

Because you and other humans are so feeble minded that you can't see the causes is not an excuse for your delusional beliefs.

Luck is a delusional belief that has no basis in science.

Sigh..........either prove me wrong or change your beliefs.

For if you CANT prove me wrong you have no reason to not believe me.

If you CANT prove me wrong, then what reason do you have for not believing me. HUH?

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GoodScienceForYou

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #33 - Jan 29^th, 2010 at 2:03pm

MajorAtheist wrote on Jan 29^th, 2010 at 1:14pm:

GoodScienceForYou wrote on Jan 28^th, 2010 at 7:52pm:

Only a ignorant fool, who is incapable of reasoning would believe in random.

Because you and other humans are so feeble minded that you can't see the causes is not an excuse for your delusional beliefs.

Luck is a delusional belief that has no basis in science.

Sigh..........either prove me wrong or change your beliefs.

For if you CANT prove me wrong you have no reason to not believe me.

If you CANT prove me wrong, then what reason do you have for not believing me. HUH?

You present magical causes and mystical creatures in your religion. I don't.

You can only go where the evidence takes you and you cannot apply belief to evidence.

As soon as you have beliefs you have no credibility.

I pity you.

You are the one who needs to do the testing. It is up to you to perform the tasks necessary to prove or disprove.

I clearly state foundational scientific facts that are irrefutable, and you still want to believe in fairy tales.

You are lazy, clear as can be. You rely on others to control your mind. That is really sad. you need to belong to the club of religious believers is pathetic. You march rank and file like a good Nazi who conforms to your fears.

Conforming to other people is a sign of weakness, no matter who they are.

I pity you.

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MajorAtheist

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #34 - Jan 29^th, 2010 at 4:22pm

GoodScienceForYou wrote on Jan 29^th, 2010 at 2:03pm:

MajorAtheist wrote on Jan 29^th, 2010 at 1:14pm:

GoodScienceForYou wrote on Jan 28^th, 2010 at 7:52pm:

Only a ignorant fool, who is incapable of reasoning would believe in random.

Because you and other humans are so feeble minded that you can't see the causes is not an excuse for your delusional beliefs.

Luck is a delusional belief that has no basis in science.

Sigh..........either prove me wrong or change your beliefs.

For if you CANT prove me wrong you have no reason to not believe me.

If you CANT prove me wrong, then what reason do you have for not believing me. HUH?

You present magical causes and mystical creatures in your religion. I don't.

Then you are either stupid or can't read. Go back and try to understand again.

Oh heck, let's play fill in the blank.

MajorAtheist said that the outcome of the flip is due to _______________________! Physics or magic?

How many more times must you lie??? I PITY YOU SEVERELY!!!!

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MajorAtheist

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #35 - Jan 29^th, 2010 at 4:41pm

MajorAtheist wrote on Jan 29^th, 2010 at 11:39am:

GoodScienceForYou wrote on Jan 27^th, 2010 at 8:58am:

Listen to me this has nothing to do with God,but with your magical beliefs in random.

You can either listen or you can turn your head to what I have said and proved, just so you don't have to believe me. It really comes down to how honest you can be!

I have proven that the outcome of a coin flip is random between heads or tails, and is dependent upon the physics involved during said flip.

Sure keep saying that my beliefs are magical, all the while you know that you are lying when you do so!

Still waiting for you to be honest just once!

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GoodScienceForYou YaBB Administrator Offline The obvious isn't obvious until it is obvious Posts: 1361 United States Gender:	Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics. Reply #36 - Jan 30^th, 2010 at 8:33am All of science is cause and effect or cause and result. There are no magical things such as random. Are we now agreed?
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MajorAtheist

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #37 - Jan 30^th, 2010 at 5:47pm

GoodScienceForYou wrote on Jan 30^th, 2010 at 8:33am:

All of science is cause and effect or cause and result.

There are no magical things such a random.

Are we now agreed?

Science is the study of causes and their effects. Reality IS cause and effect.

Since you did not KNOW of which physical forces were going to be involved in that coin experiment, proven by not being 100% accurate, were the outcomes predictable or unpredictable. Unpredictable, right?

If they were predictable, then you should have gotten 100% accuracy!
If they were unpredictable, WHICH I KNOW THEY WERE, then the term to used describe unpredictable outcomes is RANDOM.

Outcomes that are 'difficult or impossible to foretell'......is called unpredictable. Those outcomes; therefore are considered random. Just like outcomes that are 'easy or possible to foretell'.........is called predictable. Those outcomes; are considered precise or ordered based on the calculations used to predict.

It doesnt mean that physics are not involved, it is just a term to describe the unpredictable outcomes due to the multitude of physical forces involved.

If we knew, then we could predict 100% accurately. Since we can't predict with 100% accuracy, this proves there are many physics involved that we did not or could not have known or else we would have predicted accurately!!!!!!

AGREED?

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GoodScienceForYou

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #38 - Jan 30^th, 2010 at 9:41pm

I have gone over this before. Being predictable has nothing to do with random. Random is not even a real word. It is a concept in abstract math that has never been shown to be part of the real physical world.

Every event in existence can be reduced to all the causes and calculated. You can do empirical testing on any physical event and determine all the causes and the way the forces work on ANY EVENT!

Just because YOU don't know what and how it works, does not make any event random. It is a human weakness to try and see things like luck. Or to use words like random to make an excuse for how stupid they are.

When some guy gets "hot" on the dice playing craps, it is because of how he is holding the dice, and trowing them, not because of luck. If he has a certain way of holding the dice and his "lucky" method is to put the two sixes together or whatever is part of his method. The next night he my crap out every time using what he thought was his "lucky" throw. It is because of the conditions of his muscles, his mental state etc that cause those dice to go hot for a while, but that rarely returns.

I have read about 6 books by professional gamblers in my life, people who actually make money on observing other people and making money on "hot" players. There is usually a pattern and a good observer will know when the thrower goes cold.

I read books on most subjects that deals with life and science.

There is no such thing a luck. There is no such thing as random. Both are fantasy created by people to explain things they don't understand.

When you are in business for yourself, you know that luck is not real. You study the market, make decisions based on experience and knowledge. That is what makes people lucky.
Being nice to other people and loving other people is part of that as well.

I do know this; There are a lot of people out there who want to use you, want to make you a pawn of their beliefs. If that is what you allow. I never allow people to do that to me, ever. People who actually care about you will tell you the truth.

It is the foundation of free thought.

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"Find the truth for yourself and don't succumb to indoctrination."

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MajorAtheist

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #39 - Jan 30^th, 2010 at 9:46pm

GoodScienceForYou wrote on Jan 30^th, 2010 at 9:41pm:

I have gone over this before. Being predictable has nothing to do with random. Random is not even a real word. It is a concept in abstract math that has never been shown to be part of the real physical world.

Every event in existence can be reduced to all the causes and calculated. You can do empirical testing on any physical event and determine all the causes and the way the forces work on ANY EVENT!

Just because YOU don't know what and how it works, does not make any event random. It is a human weakness to try and see things like luck. Or to use words like random to make an excuse for how stupid they are.

When some guy gets "hot" on the dice playing craps, it is because of how he is holding the dice, and trowing them, not because of luck. If he has a certain way of holding the dice and his "lucky" method is to put the two sixes together or whatever is part of his method. The next night he my crap out every time using what he thought was his "lucky" throw. It is because of the conditions of his muscles, his mental state etc that cause those dice to go hot for a while, but that rarely returns.

I have read about 6 books by professional gamblers in my life, people who actually make money on observing other people and making money on "hot" players. There is usually a pattern and a good observer will know when the thrower goes cold.

I read books on most subjects that deals with life and science.

There is no such thing a luck. There is no such thing as random. Both are fantasy created by people to explain things they don't understand.

When you are in business for yourself, you know that luck is not real. You study the market, make decisions based on experience and knowledge. That is what makes people lucky.
Being nice to other people and loving other people is part of that as well.

I do know this; There are a lot of people out there who want to use you, want to make you a pawn of their beliefs. If that is what you allow. I never allow people to do that to me, ever. People who actually care about you will tell you the truth.

It is the foundation of free thought.

I have explained everything to you.

Sadly, you have failed to prove me wrong. Go back and read and copy/paste an argument/statement that I made and SHOW me where it is wrong.

When you can't do this, you have NO reason to not believe me..........unless you are not smart or you FEAR your God!

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MajorAtheist

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #40 - Jan 30^th, 2010 at 11:56pm

GoodScienceForYou wrote on Jan 30^th, 2010 at 9:41pm:

Just because YOU don't know what and how it works, does not make any event random.

LOL! That's why I said because we don't know what and how it works, makes the outcome random.......not that the event is random!!

OMG, its like talking to a frog!!

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MajorAtheist

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #41 - Jan 31^st, 2010 at 8:07am

GoodScienceForYou wrote on Jan 30^th, 2010 at 9:41pm:

When some guy gets "hot" on the dice playing craps, it is because of how he is holding the dice, and trowing them, not because of luck. If he has a certain way of holding the dice and his "lucky" method is to put the two sixes together or whatever is part of his method. The next night he my crap out every time using what he thought was his "lucky" throw. It is because of the conditions of his muscles, his mental state etc that cause those dice to go hot for a while, but that rarely returns.

EXACTLY right and I think you finally got it!

So if it is the condition of his muscles that cause those dice to go hot or cold for a while................what if SOME OTHER force plays a role and you did not know about it?

What happens when the outcome is NOT what you predicted? The condition of the muscles or some other force must have changed to effect the outcome.

Since the outcome was different than what you predicted, this is how you know some other force was applied, even though you don't know exactly what force caused the change.

Since you dont know what forced caused the change, the outcome became unpredictable because of this physical force; therefore random between heads or tails.

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Maelstrom

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #42 - Feb 1^st, 2010 at 12:46am

Goodscience - He means that randomness isn't what many would consider random.. As in a random number between 1 - 10. He is saying that randomness within the universe is based off of an unknown variable. This unknown variable causes us to believe the outcome is unpredictable. Unpredictability equates to a random effect. If the variable is ever changing like the temperature for example, the entire equation would SEEM random simply because of its unpredictable nature. So when physicists and scientists refer to something being random.. they mean that it is currently unpredictable with our current level of technology. Just because something isn't random however, isn't proof of a God. The reason being is that for every attribute that you can apply to God, I could remove the none factors from the equation meaning that God himself is a none factor since there is nothing that God can do that the universe can't do. The universe is VERY conservative. The chances of the universe actually having a divine power behind it is actually an impossibility because of the conservative nature of existence. (What I mean by conservative I do not mean that the universe chose a political party. I mean that the universe doesn't apply variables to the equations that it calculates which take absolutely no effect at all. Also - Two things cannot share the same attributes if they both do the exact same thing. It would cancel out one of the attributes since both aren't needed.)
So in essence - God isn't needed.

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GoodScienceForYou

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #43 - Feb 1^st, 2010 at 8:38pm

MajorAtheist wrote on Jan 30^th, 2010 at 9:46pm:

GoodScienceForYou wrote on Jan 30^th, 2010 at 9:41pm:

I have gone over this before. Being predictable has nothing to do with random. Random is not even a real word. It is a concept in abstract math that has never been shown to be part of the real physical world.

Every event in existence can be reduced to all the causes and calculated. You can do empirical testing on any physical event and determine all the causes and the way the forces work on ANY EVENT!

Just because YOU don't know what and how it works, does not make any event random. It is a human weakness to try and see things like luck. Or to use words like random to make an excuse for how stupid they are.

When some guy gets "hot" on the dice playing craps, it is because of how he is holding the dice, and trowing them, not because of luck. If he has a certain way of holding the dice and his "lucky" method is to put the two sixes together or whatever is part of his method. The next night he my crap out every time using what he thought was his "lucky" throw. It is because of the conditions of his muscles, his mental state etc that cause those dice to go hot for a while, but that rarely returns.

I have read about 6 books by professional gamblers in my life, people who actually make money on observing other people and making money on "hot" players. There is usually a pattern and a good observer will know when the thrower goes cold.

I read books on most subjects that deals with life and science.

There is no such thing a luck. There is no such thing as random. Both are fantasy created by people to explain things they don't understand.

When you are in business for yourself, you know that luck is not real. You study the market, make decisions based on experience and knowledge. That is what makes people lucky.
Being nice to other people and loving other people is part of that as well.

I do know this; There are a lot of people out there who want to use you, want to make you a pawn of their beliefs. If that is what you allow. I never allow people to do that to me, ever. People who actually care about you will tell you the truth.

It is the foundation of free thought.

I have explained everything to you.

Sadly, you have failed to prove me wrong. Go back and read and copy/paste an argument/statement that I made and SHOW me where it is wrong.

When you can't do this, you have NO reason to not believe me..........unless you are not smart or you FEAR your God!

You have a f**king rut etched in your mind, and you can't get out of that f**king rut.

I am don'e with you. If you can't stop lying about science, you dumb ass!

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GoodScienceForYou

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Re: There is no such thing as random mutations in genetics.
Reply #44 - Feb 1^st, 2010 at 8:40pm

Maelstrom wrote on Feb 1^st, 2010 at 12:46am:

Goodscience - He means that randomness isn't what many would consider random.. As in a random number between 1 - 10. He is saying that randomness within the universe is based off of an unknown variable. This unknown variable causes us to believe the outcome is unpredictable. Unpredictability equates to a random effect. If the variable is ever changing like the temperature for example, the entire equation would SEEM random simply because of its unpredictable nature. So when physicists and scientists refer to something being random.. they mean that it is currently unpredictable with our current level of technology. Just because something isn't random however, isn't proof of a God. The reason being is that for every attribute that you can apply to God, I could remove the none factors from the equation meaning that God himself is a none factor since there is nothing that God can do that the universe can't do. The universe is VERY conservative. The chances of the universe actually having a divine power behind it is actually an impossibility because of the conservative nature of existence. (What I mean by conservative I do not mean that the universe chose a political party. I mean that the universe doesn't apply variables to the equations that it calculates which take absolutely no effect at all. Also - Two things cannot share the same attributes if they both do the exact same thing. It would cancel out one of the attributes since both aren't needed.)
So in essence - God isn't needed.

Who the f**k took your mind from you? Why are you such a poor protector of your intelligence? Didn't any one ever tell you that people are full of garbage? That humans are really stupid.. Don't you know that?
Did your parents f**k you up? Did they make you into a f**king pawn and a "bitch" of other people?

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